In Defense of China

So, it would seem on the surface that everything China is now bad. Maybe Harvard and other elite universities are onto something, attempting to curb the asian student population in their institutions.

Sure, it’s easy to look at Hollywood and the NBA and talk about how they’ve sold out American values for higher profits. Yes, they have.

However, I must ask, with all the recent news coming out…I have to wonder, how many products from China do you purchase everyday, week or month? Have you stopped shopping on Amazon or at Walmart or Target or Costco?

How many small American businesses have been able to remain competitive, simply because of China’s low wages for workers?

So yeah, it’s easy to look outward and talk about how horrible James Harden is, when he refused to slander one of his markets.

And sure, it’s always easy to sit back and trash talk Hollywood and Disney for catering to a large portion of their market as well.

Realize that marketing is everything and everywhere. In America and the West in general, the most successful marketing strategy is the hero and villain relationship. Victims and Bullies are profit makers.

In China, it’s all about appealing to the Emperor. Chinese culture is proud and devout to their rulers. So, in order to appeal to a market like China, these people and organizations must kiss the ring.

These people must succumb to the crown, if they are to line their pockets!

Let’s be frank, until all of us are ready to exclusively buy American and hire American, none of us have any room to judge. Put your money where your mouth is.

I’m not saying what any of these people did was right, but it is understandable.

If you wanna make your dollar go farther, best not to spend it on American goods.

Perhaps the problem with China is its history of trade with America. Maybe, if it was easier and cheaper to build and manufacture in America, maybe, this wouldn’t be taking place.

Then again, who am I to judge?

Still think that $15.00 minimum wage is a great idea?

Still think that universal income will somehow offset foreign markets from invading American businesses?

Maybe, more money won’t solve a thing. Maybe more money will simply make it much easier for foreign manufacturers to continue selling in America.

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74 thoughts on “In Defense of China

  1. Marleen

    Improved relations with the Soviet Union and the PRC are often cited as the most successful diplomatic achievements of Nixon’s presidency. … The reason for opening up China was for the U.S. to gain more leverage over relations with the Soviet Union. Resolving the Vietnam War was a particularly important factor.

    { And, of course, we were tricked into the Vietnam War. }

    In addition, a “Nixon to China” moment has since become a metaphor for an unexpected, uncharacteristic or overly impactful action by a politician.

    Wikipedia

  2. You Asked — “Still think that $15.00 minimum wage is a great idea?”

    My Response — So if we pay Americans less China will be a better trade partner on the global market?

    OR

    Are you saying paying lower wages to Americans makes us a stronger country overall?

    1. bottomlesscoffee007

      Mandated higher wages will drive even more to be manufactured and produced in China.

      More money only means more regulations.

      What needs to be eliminated are the regulations on businesses in America. More regulations simply translates for businesses to look elsewhere for production, manufacturing and economy.

      1. You Stated — “Mandated higher wages will drive even more to be manufactured and produced in China.”

        My Response — Would paying executives less reduce manufacturing in China?

              1. You Asked — “How many people do you think only make minimum wage?”

                My Response — I don’t know but Google has some idea.

                In 2015, 78.2 million workers age 16 and older in the United States were paid at hourly rates, representing 58.5 percent of all wage and salary workers. Among those paid by the hour, 870,000 workers earned exactly the prevailing federal minimum wage of $7.25 per hour.

                Are you saying this forced wage would be better for America if it were lower?

                You Asked — “Would you settle for minimum wage?”

                My Response — If anyone needs food and shelter they will settle for what ever they can get. We are learning this with all the coal miners loosing their jobs and older people working in stores.

                1. bottomlesscoffee007

                  What is the criteria for more money?

                  What is stopping you from giving your own money to people you feel are in need?

                  1. You Asked — “What is the criteria for more money?”

                    It’s the same criteria for more cake, “if you can get it”

                    You Asked — “What is stopping you from giving your own money to people you feel are in need?”

                    My Response — Nothing stops me from doing it so far but I guess it’s possible to stop me with a law or strong convincing argument from someone I respect.

                    I could also be stopped if the person refused help.

                    Are you saying that Americans should remove minimum wage and rely on me giving people money?

                    1. bottomlesscoffee007

                      If you think that the minimum wage is not high enough, then yes, I think you should take action by giving people you feel don’t get paid enough, your money.

    2. bottomlesscoffee007

      If businesses can make more money in America, then more would be produced and manufactured in America, which means, there would be more jobs in America, which means, there would be more opportunity for Americans to seek out higher wages, in America.

          1. You Stated — “Why do you think there is a federal minimum wage, but there is no federal maximum wage?”

            My Response — Are you saying that the federal minimum wage is designed to weaken the American workforce?

              1. You Asked — “No, what I’m asking is why is there no cap on what a person can earn?”

                My Response — Because greed rules the world.

                Are you saying that because the rich have no restrictions it justifies having a lower minimum wage?

                  1. You Asked — “Lander, I don’t know where you get these wild questions.”

                    My Response — I thought they were simple but if it’s a bit wild let’s save it for another day. It’s to late at night for wild.

                    1. You Stated — “Why do you think companies move overseas?”

                      My Response — There are several reasons that I am aware of:

                      — Avoid restrictions on air and land pollution
                      — Avoid providing medical insurance
                      — Avoid restrictions on child labor
                      — Avoid lawsuits due to hazardous working conditions
                      — Increased off books profiteering
                      — Exploitation of cheap labor
                      — Access to cheaper raw materials with less logistics
                      — Absence of federal laws for banking practices

                    2. bottomlesscoffee007

                      Exactly Lander, those and many more. If the regulations in America weren’t so stringent, then more companies would manufacture and produce in America. The more work there is, the more companies will compete for better workers.

                      The less opportunity for work in America, the more workers compete for better work and better wages with fewer companies.

                      The more companies in America, the more they will compete for better workers by offering better wages and benefits.

                    3. You Stated — “If the regulations in America weren’t so stringent, then more companies would manufacture and produce in America. ”

                      My Response — So are you saying that if we allow the list below it will be better for America and American workers?

                      Remove restrictions on air and land pollution
                      Remove providing medical insurance
                      Remove restrictions on child labor
                      Remove lawsuits due to hazardous working conditions
                      Increase off book profiteering
                      Exploit cheap labor
                      Force raw materials to be sold cheaper and provide free logistics
                      Remove federal laws for banking practices

                    4. You Stated — The words you choose seem intent on negativity.

                      My Response — But aren’t they the exact same words you just agreed with a moment ago?

                      Recap:

                      You Stated — “Why do you think companies move overseas?”

                      My Response — There are several reasons that I am aware of:

                      — Avoid restrictions on air and land pollution
                      — Avoid providing medical insurance
                      — Avoid restrictions on child labor
                      — Avoid lawsuits due to hazardous working conditions
                      — Increased off books profiteering
                      — Exploitation of cheap labor
                      — Access to cheaper raw materials with less logistics
                      — Absence of federal laws for banking practices

                      You Stated — “Exactly Lander, those and many more. If the regulations in America weren’t so stringent, then more companies would manufacture and produce in America. ”

                      My Response — So are you saying that if we allow the list below it will be better for America and American workers?

                      Remove restrictions on air and land pollution
                      Remove providing medical insurance
                      Remove restrictions on child labor
                      Remove lawsuits due to hazardous working conditions
                      Increase off book profiteering
                      Exploit cheap labor
                      Force raw materials to be sold cheaper and provide free logistics
                      Remove federal laws for banking practices

                      At the moment I’m just trying to understand your logic for why to make America more like China to keep jobs here. I’m not being positive or negative since I haven’t stated my position. I’m just asking questions about your position.

                      Let me change that and state my thoughts on this topic.

                      If it were me I would force other countries to meet our standards before trading with them, rather than trying to reduce ourselves to their substandard living conditions.

                      If we promote trade with countries that embrace substandard living conditions then we are seeking failure.

                      If America wants to be #1 then we need to have a high standard of living, education, and medical care. We would need to be the country people seek out not seek to be more like the countries that people are trying to escape.

                      Just a thought

                    5. bottomlesscoffee007

                      What measures would you use to force those other countries to adopt the same “standards” that are used in America?

                      Do you think that it is good for America and Americans that the regulations imposed here make manufacturing and production more appealing overseas?

                      What products will you not buy, because they are made using unethical work practices?

                    6. You Asked — “What measures would you use to force those other countries to adopt the same “standards” that are used in America?”

                      My Answer — None. I simply wouldn’t trade with anyone who wasn’t at a standard level inline with ours.

                      You Asked — “Do you think that it is good for America and Americans that the regulations imposed here make manufacturing and production more appealing overseas?”

                      My Answer — I’m not aware of any imposed regulations since we are a nation of laws not dictatorship. Anything not liked by the American people can be removed through the process of elections. Isn’t Trump rolling back regulations Oo

                      You Asked — “What products will you not buy, because they are made using unethical work practices?”

                      My Response — None. I’ll buy anything I want for whatever reason I deem fit.

                    7. bottomlesscoffee007

                      Ha, I like your double speak lander. On one side of your mouth, you push the idea of social justice, yet on the other side of your mouth, you refuse to adhere to the standards you expect others to follow.

                      Your not as principled as I thought. More or less, you talk a good game, when in reality, you don’t want people to realize, you’re just like everyone else.

                    8. You Stated — “..I like your double speak lander… you push the idea of social justice, yet… you refuse to adhere to the standards you expect others to follow.”

                      Because I Said — “If America wants to be #1 then we need to have a high standard of living, education, and medical care. We would need to be the country people seek out not seek to be more like the countries that people are trying to escape.”

                      My Response — Interesting words but I’m not a talking point kind of person so they don’t mean anything to me.

                      As for social justice there is no such thing.

                      If you think you understand my position because I ask you questions about yours then you are intentionally ignoring my presence in the conversation.

                      Wouldn’t it be better to ask me what I believe rather than applying a talking point title to me?

                      Just a thought

                      You Stated — “Your not as principled as I thought.”

                      My Response — What you think of me has no value to our conversation. Only the truth of our positions on what we understand in relation to the reality we are living in matters.

                      But if it speeds things up, I have no principles other than I believe God exist and is good.

                      prin·ci·ple
                      noun
                      1.a fundamental truth or proposition that serves as the foundation for a system of belief or behavior or for a chain of reasoning.

                      You Stated — “More or less, you talk a good game, when in reality, you don’t want people to realize, you’re just like everyone else.”

                      My Response — This statement is nonsensical. We are all unique human beings with similar lives. We are always like other people. More importantly what I want or don’t want still has no value to the truth.

                      We may be having two very different conversations. I don’t have a goal talking to you other than to gain more perspective. I want to be surprised by an interesting and truth revealing concept or connection I may have missed (If it makes sense).

                      Let’s make this easier, you win the debate and I think you are very intelligent and I have flaws. Now let’s go back to the discussion and leave the personal stuff out since it doesn’t have any value.

                      Do you think America would be better if it were more like China or India?
                      Do you think Technology is the solution to our problems or the cause of them?
                      Do you think God is real?
                      Do you think drugs should be free to purchase for anyone who wants them without the courts and laws getting in the way?

                      I’m curious what you think but I may challenge your answers if it pleases me to do so, so don’t answer if that’s going to stress you.

                    9. bottomlesscoffee007

                      I believe in God, I think that the rules we live by/governed by/ or simply adopt as a gesture of good faith…are really nonsensical.

                      Debate? I’m no debater. I just find it humorous that rather than arguing your opinion, you seem set on catching me up in some type of word play.

                      Technology is not the problem as it has never been a problem. People are the problem and always have been the problem.

                      Yeah, I’m all about adhering to the normal rules that every society has held in high regard, don’t rape, don’t murder, don’t steal or lie…etc. maybe the 10 commandments, I don’t know, I do know that the laws we have, are basically useless at obliging society. Rather, they are the end of the road in my mind.

                      Maybe I’m an anarchist, maybe I’m not? Who knows?

                      But I will say, laws are targeted only at the law abiding, society n the constant attempt to control only the law abiding, thereby, laws do not care about the law breakers.

                      Humans by our very nature are more adaptive than we are usually given credit for.

                      Do I think America is better than any other country, meh, not really, then again guns are cool. So maybe, by a cunt hair margin at best. But that is also slipping away as time marches on.

                      I think the artificial boundaries we place amongst one another is the real crux. If we can see the humanity in our adversary than we can acknowledge their right to live as well.

                      Drugs? Yeah, let people take whatever they want, it’s their body, their choice.

                      You see that’s the real issue, if you will. Instead of cutting the cord persay, people pretend as if they are making conscious decisions, when in reality, the decisions they make are more about social acceptance and they know the safety net will only allow them to fall so far.

                      Remove the safety net, perhaps more would make more mature and professional decisions.

                      Then again, who really knows.

                      I’ll say one thing, societies have been studied since the dawn of time and still, we are aimless and suffer from short and long term memory loss.

                      Society and the human race, talk about a clown show.

                    10. You Stated — “you seem set on catching me up in some type of word play.”

                      My Response — Interesting perspective on why I ask you questions on what you post. If I follow this logic what would be the prize for “catching you up”?

                      Just out of curiosity, when you ask me questions are trying to “catch me up” or is this just something that my questions do?

                      You Stated — “Technology is not the problem as it has never been a problem. People are the problem and always have been the problem.”

                      My Response — Now this is something I find of interest. Is it possible that people are making problematic technology on purpose?

                      You Stated — “Yeah, I’m all about adhering to the normal rules that every society has held in high regard, don’t …lie”

                      My Reponse — The others seem about right but society itself seems based on lies so this one seems a bit more complicated.

                      You Stated — “laws are targeted only at the law abiding… laws do not care about the law breakers.”

                      My Response — I think drug dealers would heavily disagree with this one.

                      You Stated — “I think the artificial boundaries we place amongst one another is the real crux.”

                      My Question — Can you give an example of one of these “artificial boundaries”?

                      You Stated — “If we can see the humanity in our adversary than we can acknowledge their right to live as well.”

                      My Qestion — Who is your “adversary”?

                      You Stated — “Drugs? Yeah, let people take whatever they want, it’s their body, their choice.”

                      My Response — Agreed.

                      You Stated — “Remove the safety net, perhaps more would make more mature and professional decisions.”

                      My Response — I’m not sure what the safety net thing is but I say let people do what they want with drugs who am I to judge.

                      You Stated — “Society and the human race, talk about a clown show.”

                      My Response — Well said.

                    11. bottomlesscoffee007

                      Technology. I don’t believe people will willfully make problematic technology (some will, but not the majority in my opinion). The problem with people and technology is that technology will bolster the hubris of man, man will assume he is a god. Therefore, technology is not the problem, the prideful spirit is.

                      Your response to the rules question, can you expound?

                      Drug dealers, the only drug dealers that face penalties are the drug dealers that are found to be insignificant to the greater goal of mass sedation and mass inebriation. The real drug dealers are labeled legitimate by the powers that be.

                      Artificial boundaries, sure, languages, affiliations, etc.

                      Adversary, to be honest, I do not have any. It’s more of a catch all, if we can see the humanity in those whom we wholly disagree with, then perhaps the problem is not as deep as we initially think it is.

                      The safety net, welfare, food stamps, free school lunches, police, Fire, etc. basically all public assistance programs and publicly funded everything. Remove all of that, and people will suddenly realize that their decisions have consequences on those who make them, not the public at large.

                      No prize for catching me up. Just seems odd that you would not state your opinion as well. I’m good with discussing what I had said or wrote, but you seem quite intent on picking apart my stance, without offering any real insight into why you feel the way you do. Whether that be in agreement disagreement.

                    12. This conversation almost sounds like we need to step backwards into a 3rd world nation to compete for jobs. So, if America acts more like communist dictatorships with few operational regulations, the multi-national companies will all move back and employ us?

                      These big companies have no desire to offer better wages and benefits. Amazon, with their permanent PT work schedule (no benefits) and tracking every movement of their employees to the point of people pissing in trashcans, is the “new” work design. Read about the woman that was fired because she spent an hour too long looking after a sick family member?

                      How does a nation (that once had a soul) compete with a 3rd world nation that employs children when we were smart enough (at one time) to abolish that practice? Or compete with nation that doesn’t care if it poisons the water (hell, we got that here, now)?

                      Capitalism can work if properly employed. So far, it hasn’t been. Greed and corruption ruins EVERYTHING.

                    13. bottomlesscoffee007

                      From the highest mountain top, to the lowest point in the ocean, greed always prevails, regardless of anything.

                  1. Of course not. The corrupt on the top tier would find a way around such a cap…write themselves in as exempt from said law or regulation or whatever.

                    Capitalism would work just fine if everyone played by the rules. But, they don’t. Plus, it is drilled into our heads from birth that over the top materialism is the pathway to happiness. It isn’t but, that’s the narrative that is pushed.

                    A fair wage for honest work died in the 60s. If anyone thinks that $7.25 minimum wage, in today’s world, is a fair, living wage can’t do math. There are some states that have already gone to $15 and Australia is there, now.

                    The bottom line is, our dollar is, essentially, worthless and all this clamoring about the minimum wage is really redundant. As long as the private institution Fed continues to print money out of thin air to cover banks & corporations asses, we will have another financial crisis.

                    1. bottomlesscoffee007

                      Exactly right Victoria. More money doesn’t solve problems if a person doesn’t have their priorities in line.

                    2. Marleen

                      That applies for the top and, often, those near the top. It’s less true (to not true at all) for those at the bottom.

                    3. Marleen

                      Have no idea why that’s hilarious except for ignorance (and indoctrination from those at the top who want to keep everyone outa their way). It’s a race to the bottom. How can we be more like China? People (including children) who got caught up in the literal cogs of machinery during the early industrial revolution weren’t laughing. They were dying. And people are still dying. We should be more like that, apparently.

                    4. Marleen

                      Oh… right; imputed greed of the people on the bottom is perpetually the point in the world of some people (you do the dispiriting propagandist work of those who are the richest and most ruthless). I, on the other hand, was agreeing with “math.” Being compensated for work at a reasonable level does solve some problems for those at and near the bottom. Fact. [ There is always the caveat that they might have a drug addiction or something, but that’s true for rich people too. So, it doesn’t justify Chinese slave conditions. ]

                    5. Marleen

                      Yes. After Coffee replied to your complex post(s) with this shorter post of his own: Exactly right Victoria. More money doesn’t solve problems if a person doesn’t have their priorities in line.

                      I don’t know why he responded to me as if I’d said something about poor people being “greedy” or not. I’d said nothing about that. I agree with you in a lot that you said, including:
                      … anyone thinks that $7.25 minimum wage, in today’s world, is a fair, living wage can’t do math.

                    6. Ok. Well, instead of replying to Coffee’s comments, you were replying to me and I was LOST.

                      If you are using your phone, you have to be careful who you are replying to. Since this is his blog, it’s easy for him to track who is saying what. It was confusing me.

                    7. Marleen

                      The response boxes had gotten to the point where the last “REPLY” button available is the one I was using.

                    8. Wait. Are you commenting on the actual website? THAT can be a big issue, worse than keeping your replies straight on a phone. Visiting actual websites to comment limits you in nesting. The settings are permanently stuck at ten comments deep. After ten comments below an original comment, the reply buttons disappear.

                      The grestest flexibility is in the Reader, signed in, on a PC, laptop or, possibly, a Tablet (unsure of their programming & setup). I take it that you don’t have a blog of your own, judging by the fact that your name isn’t a link.

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